Obama, Pelosi, Schumer and 2/3rds if Democrats want him out but he’s refusing like an old man whose grown children are trying to take away the car keys before he hurts someone.
Unlike those grown children, Democrats don’t hold the same love and care for grandpa to force them to grow a pair of balls to know that it’s in everyone’s best interest and force the issue to pass.
“Most important election in my life” my ass; all that they have to do is stop helping a genocide and they would win, but no.
Most important election in my life
Nothing else at stake here other then his election apparently. Can’t help but think about that press release where he blurted out “how do I make this not sound self-centered” before answering why he was wasn’t stepping down. Ouf.
I think at this point it’s because the DNC is going to shove him down our throats anyway with their expedited digital vote next Friday so instead of causing even more disruption by throwing a wrench into that at the absolute last minute which will cause bad optics for Democrats, they’re just resigned to losing entirely.
“Funny” thing is people keep saying “the rich are safe so they don’t care if we lose to a fascist.” and they couldn’t be more wrong. I don’t for one second think Trump isn’t going after the DNC as well as the party itself.
“Funny” thing is people keep saying “the rich are safe so they don’t care if we lose to a fascist.” and they couldn’t be more wrong. I don’t for one second think Trump isn’t going after the DNC as well as the party itself.
i think that we’re on track to repeat history and the last time this happened the rich either fled or switched to facism to protect their wealth.
Bribery is legal now so the rich think they’ll just bribe it away.
You were doing okay until the genocide thing. I doubt the “genocide” even enters into it for most independent voters.
I think it’s foolish to chase “independent” voters (which I assume you’re saying to mean the mythical “moderate”). What Biden is fighting is apathy.
Joe Biden being unwilling to call out the genocide in Palestine absolutely drives apathy among voters who feel disenfranchised by the current two party system.
If the Democrats truly cared about winning elections, they’d court the left and drive voter engagement. If we drive up turnout, the Democrats win every time, even with the ridiculously broken electoral college.
None of those apathetic voters ever have an answer to how Trump will be better for the Palestinians.
Blaming the voters for being apathetic when the party hasn’t given them a reason to be excited sure does seem to be in vogue among Democrat apologists.
it’s bizarre that they expect leftist to vote along with them when they’ve done nothing to earn leftist voters; lets see if the dnc has learned this lesson in their next presidential pic.
More likely they’ll just pick some former swing state governor to be Kamala’s veep.
glenn beck made the single strongest case i’ve heard for kamala this morning: of all the electeds in DC, she was ONE of EIGHTEEN signatories on the green new deal.
i really didn’t think i’d come around on her, but glenn is who sold me on obama too so it makes sense.
Just who the fuck do you thing you are using history and logic?
Those apathetic voters that would vote for donnie or not vote at all, and all over the “genocide joe” thing, should give pause and ask themselves how they are helping the situation by assisting donnie.
As for the independent voters, I’m talking about the low-information voters for the most part in this instance. The kind of people deeply influenced by optics. Optics like donnie getting nearly killed, then raising his fist for a photo op. Or optics like #BidenSoOld, Biden cancelling a speech for Covid, Biden bombing at a debate. I’m not even sure most of these people know or remember that Gaza is happening. Just like when Biden was going on about NATO. Again, it’s doubtful these low-information voters care much about NATO. I doubt even high-information voters place NATO as their number one concern…
(In other cases, when I say independent voters, I am usually referring to what the Republicans typically call themselves when they don’t want to admit they are voting for tools like Bush and donnie)
I have literally NEVER, not once, ever anywhere, seen someone on the left who dislikes joes stance on genocide, decide the only logical thing to do is vote Biden. That’s a fucking joke and you’re an idiot for believing anyone who says that is actually left. Anyone who says that is playing pretend on the internet, likely for money.
Um, what? What do they propose, then? Throwing their vote away so that donnie gets in power? How is that helping?
Yes. That’s it. They don’t want to vote for genocide, and wrongly believe that choosing inaction absolves them of responsibility.
Well, they are not entirely inactive - they’ll tell you, at every opportunity, just how MORALLY SUPERIOR they are to “centrists”, “liberals”, etc…
Voting is inaction.
Action is action.
Tell me the plan that gets more unified support than the current president.
Anything other than the current president.
The Dems trying to start the campaign over from scratch with someone else this far into the year is just stupid. It’s giving the election to the Republicunts and they’re salivating.
They shouldn’t have had hm run in the fucking first place and been able to actually plan a campaign. This is so fucking amateurish it’s pathetic.
Strong disagree.
I live in a small bubble so to speak, and am only as good as what I see online and the few people I talk to about this. I would personally be way more engaged and excited if biden steps down, and so would a few of my friend/colleagues I’m comfortable talking about this topic with.
I think biden staying in is our worst chance at beating trump. If he leaves dem voters will be energized. If he and kamala are both out, even more energized.
I’m way way more nervous if biden sticks it out. Biden can barely walk without help, and barely speak coherently. The optics are extremely important. And now dumbass trump has that stupid fist in the air meme.
He needs to drop out now.
Biden is the best chance of winning. Any other choice means Trump wins.
Why do you say that? Every dem and “independent” I talk to tell me they don’t want Biden or Harris but they’d be eager to vote for anyone under 60 who is even remotely progressive.
If Biden did a press conference with Newson tomorrow announcing he’s passing his campaign to a new generation they would be totally psyched.
Every non-maga I talk to is happy to vote for him. This idea that no one wants Biden is something I’m only hearing on lemmy. And the timing is pretty sus
I don’t care about arbitrary numbers for age, but Biden just looks lost. It’s about cognitive decline. I’ll vote him anyway, but a lot of normies think he’s “too old” and that means he might not win against someone that should be very beatable (donnie).
Literally every point of actual data disagrees with you.
What did the data say for Hillary vs Trump? Pretty accurate eh?
I’m just not buying that. I think Biden’s people and a lot of people walking on eggshells for him may have convinced themselves of that (maybe). But I bet that narrative flips the minute he steps down.
I’m not buying that. Trying to change candidates this late in the game is such a bad idea that the only person that would suggest it is someone who wants Trump to win.
As someone that’s mostly been an outsider, this playing out has given me more faith in the Democratic Party than I’ve ever had. For as long as I can remember, they’ve been the feckless, controlled opposition party that might occasionally throw some rights and economic opportunity my way by accident. When they lose a presidential election, it’s always “aw, shucks, we’ll get 'em next time.”
This isn’t that. This is the party publicly airing no confidence in their president in July in an election year. This is an emergency and they’ve broken the glass because there’s a real threat to the country.
The glass can’t be unbroken at this point. If somehow Biden still became the nominee, all Trump’s campaign has to do is point out how his party doesn’t even believe he should be president again. The senior party officials knew that going in, and it’s why they must continue to mount private, public, and donor pressure on Biden until he gives it up.
Very well said, and I totally agree. I finally have some respect for the dem party specifically for this. I feel like the usual dem establishment tactics would dictate staying the course with biden, following procedure, etc. By them encouraging him to drop out this late, there is a respect given towards the voter base recognizing we really want someone else, and the real concern of making sure trump doesn’t win. This is a truly progressive act, going against the norm, breaking the emergency glass very much needed.
Honestly I think we could destroy trump with a new ticket. The problem now is for biden to have the courage to make the right decision and drop out. If he doesn’t ill have no choice but to vote for him, but yikes.
I’d also add my speculation that the repubs want biden to stay in, as he’s their best shot at winning.
Anyone else would be an unknown, and I think would be positive.
That’s my impression too. They know they can beat Biden/Harris. They don’t know if they can beat a different ticket.
Biden is easily the best chance of winning
How? No one wants to vote for him. We are all voting for “Not Trump”. Someone that people want to vote for who isn’t Trump should perform better.
Everyone I know is happy to vote for him. This idea of changing candidates is only being pushed online right now as far as I can see. Pretty convenient timing too.
30% approval?
What were the approval ratings for Trump vs Hillary? Pretty accurate eh?
I’ve seen you say that a few times here but haven’t seen an argument. I’m just curious, why do you think that?
He beat Trump once. He’s the incumbent. Changing this late in the game is going to cause a clusterfuck so bad that it would guarantee Trump’s win.
Name literally one.
That’s not a plan
This is a good example.
no one knows the right answer but we all know what the wrong answers are because we keep doing them and here we are.
They don’t have one and even if they did Biden is the best chance of winning.
This is a public statement. Privately, he’s been saying much different things
is there a place i can go read up on it?
Wow. So the user that does the lion’s share of the posting on news/politics on lemmy.world (from what I’ve observed) states his confound knowledge of the private conversations of POTUS. The very same lemmy.world that has an overwhelming amount of posted coverage of democrats urging Joe Biden to step down, to an arguably oppressive degree. Without a replacement even considered aside from VP Harris. Four months before a presidential election. With the known American attention span. Smells awful.
For the love of all that is holy, vote blue in November to avoid immediate Fascism and CONTINUE to press for our rights and dignity as human beings!
Four months before a presidential election. With the known American attention span.
You do realize that those two facts mean the opposite is what you imply in your comment, right?
My comment and its underlying meaning imply that there isn’t enough time to put in a new candidate. Four months from November, there isn’t adequate time to get everyone necessary on board, and too much influence will bleed off to Trump. I mean put Biden in now, fix it after we’ve cleared the election OR put a strong candidate up NOW with unequivocal confidence and put all the money and skill available behind it. Not committing to a strong course of action now (one way or the other) is tantamount to sabotage.
Im not privy to any secret POTUS convos. I’m just stating what I’ve read in the news.
I don’t mod on politics, so I can’t speak for them, but the content on Lemmy seems to reflect the content I’ve seen in media coverage
I get hot about this, @jeffw. You make a good contribution to the site, content wise. Perhaps I could try my hand at balancing things out, if I were up for it. I merely see a preponderance of people or otherwise spamming Biden step down content without proposing a solution, and I see it as propaganda and a direct assist to Trump. So if anyone wants to help destroy our fucking country, please, continue to downvote any objection and obfuscating any positive direction the democrats might have.
quick edit: I think I’m reacting to a fate already sealed and pissing in the wind, likely. Better to watch the remnant embers of what constituted American representative government be extinguished since the people seem very invested in that. Whether they realize it or not, they are in aid of fascism and their own demise.
Democrats are about to get fucked hard, and their hubris did it to them
We all know there is no one they could run that would make you happy.
I would vote for anyone. I would vote for Biden, but very much do not want to. If they put someone else in there who wasn’t also a fascist, then I’d vote for them. The problem is that Biden is not doing very well and is being a shit by not listening to anyone around him. Democrats are fucking retarded because this should have been happening 2 or 3 fucking YEARS ago. The Democrats are incompetent pieces of shit who are also the only thing keeping this country together. They need to behave like they actually know how to govern.
That’s correct, the party as a whole do not represent the working class. I would speculate most democrat voters agree but feel trapped in the 2 party system and would never vocally discuss their dissatisfaction for fear of being ostracized by their peers.
Case in point, the other reply to yours
Edit sp
So tell me, again- how much do you think you’ll accomplish by doing nothing? Additionally- when in history has doing nothing helped a situation like this? I’d love for you to name an event. Just ONE event in history where not voting brought a positive change. Because by not voting, you’re essentially saying you’re okay with things the way they are and are willing to let chance dictate the lives of others.
And tell me again how you want age restrictions on candidates. If you had your way- We’d never have even had a shot with Bernie. And he’d be retired.
You can cry all you want that the system is broken, but at the end of the day- it isn’t going to be changed by a bunch of blowhards staying home and whining on the internet.
Oh, and lastly:
If we’re going to be judged on how people respond to us, you probably should delete your account and find something better to do with your time. Because it seems you spread a lot of misinformation and troll quite frequently.
We are ideologically opposed and will not support your candidates. We do not want the same future as liberals, we are not on your side.
Liberals have more in common with their republican counterparts than any leftists have with democrats
So…. You didn’t bother answering my question I noticed. Is it that you know the answer will unravel your entire argument?
Tell me- when has not voting brought change?
We both know the answer. You’re just too afraid to say it out loud because doing so, will force you to face the fact that you’re actively working against everyone that is trying to avoid America becoming a dictatorship.
You’re not ever getting what you want. You know that, right? Because clearly politics don’t work the way you think it does- this is evident in the fact that what you want contradicts itself entirety. In order to get what you want- LAWS HAVE TO CHANGE. But you refuse to vote for the people that actually would change those laws.
In essence- you’re fine with things the way they are and don’t give a shit enough to take the effort do actively do anything g to change it.
instead- you’re fine to have no active role in making America a better place for marginalized citizens.
Oh, and thank you for at least admitting you don’t give a shit. I know it wasn’t a direct statement, but we all got the message loud and clear.
You can keep talking to your blue in the face, there’s a larger chance you would vote for Donald Trump than I would vote for either one of them. Imagine the way that you feel about Republicans not representing your interests, that’s how I feel about both of them. They do not represent the working class. They represent the donor class, not us.
And since Democrats have all but given up on campaigning, they’re allowing their constituents to conduct their campaign for them. They’re doing a rather shitty job trying to persuade people to vote in their favor. Voters are leading by the example set by the party “shut the fuck up and fall in line, NOW!”
Cool. Be sure to tell all the people that will suffer under trump that you were too busy being smug and selfish to be bothered trying to help them in any way.
One vote dude.
You’re not special. They won’t know you did or didn’t do anything. But no, your smug and selfish ideology won’t allow you to compromise to save people you know will suffer.
Fucking disgusting man.
Then are you more aligned with the Republicans or the Democrats? Like it or not, the election system only supports two parties. That’s what we should be pushing towards changing rather than hurting ourselves.
I’m not aligned with either, they represent the donor class, not us. They represent money while we get tossed table scraps.
The idea of reforming within is futile, no new blood obtains any positions of power until it’s determined they are not a threat to the existing power structure.
Third parties under the First Past the Post voting system are literally the threat to the power structure that will just keep them pushed down by the major parties.
The major parties may be afraid of sharing power now, but they are also seeing the threat of losing power completely when they can’t keep their coalitions together.
We see Democrats making a major move today with Biden stepping down from the race in order to placate parts of the party that are very unsatisfied. The threat is already more real today than it has ever been.
I think that people will realize that we are all in alignment about reforming the election system being better for the country, even to preserve a large part of the current power structure.
Biden himself literally said at least 50 democrats would win against Trump.
The clown I responded to admitted that the democrats can’t run anyone they’d vote for. So what Biden says or does is irrelevant. They even admitted to being here to actively convince people not to vote.
They’re essentially here to get Trump elected- intentionally or not.
I mean…
You mean, like in 2016? No. Surely not. No.
Alright this is getting fucking ridiculous. If he won’t exit with dignity then just 25th amendment his ass.
The Dems don’t want him to exit. They have the means and they know how to use it, so wanting to force him on us has to mean that it’s what the party apparatus wants, which is really just what their rich and corporate donors want
Maybe, but if Schumer, Pelosi, and Schiff are all working to get Biden out, I assume at least a sizable chunk of the leadership wants him to go.
add obama to that list but it doesn’t seem to matter; he’s dead set
Then they just need to remove him. Change the rules before the convention to release the delegates. Have his cabinet declare him unfit for office. It would be much better for the party’s chances in November if he would bow out gracefully, but if he won’t do that, take the choice away from him. He will lose, so we have to do something.
Oh that’s an interesting claim. Let’s look at the citation.
citing multiple people briefed on Obama’s thinking
Ya this isnt credible.
The goddamned fake news media at it again.
is usnews not credible enough?
My comment was sarcastic. “Fake new media” is a Trumpism.
is usnews not credible enough?
They are ostensibly working to keep them out.
For who?
Harris. Obviously. That’s how the line of succession works.
Fuck that
Hear that, everybody? PythagreousTitties isn’t on board with the VP of the sick and confused 81-year-old president being president. It’s kinda the biggest aspect of the entire point of the office of VP, but PythagreousTitties says no, sooooo 🤷♂️
No explanation, no nuance, just “fuck that” so let’s just pack it up and cross our fingers, I guess.
I’m not so sure they are an automatic shoo-in for running in the general? Maybe by convention or norms or something, but…is she the best candidate to beat donnie?
This thread isn’t about that. The original comment in this post was about the 25th amendment and the first reply was asking who would replace him. The line of succession is crystal clear that the VP is acting president when the president cannot discharge duties.
Who runs if Biden drops out is a different and important question, and while I don’t have a great and confident answer, there’s absolutely no reason why Harris wouldn’t be a good pick when we already decided she’d be fine when we voted for her to be plan b behind Biden’s 77/78 year old body, so idk why that should necessarily change right now. It’s like we agreed that she should be president if/when Biden couldn’t do it anymore, and now we’re saying he can’t do it anymore, but maybe now she shouldn’t be the backup plan we already decided that she should be?
Oh, fair enough. Yeah, if he is given the Amendment 25 treatment, then sure. I don’t think it works any other way.
Too late to find the best candidate, that would be settled in a primary. Kamila is marginally better than Biden, and has the war chest they’ve fundraised. At best we get an exciting new VP
👍
Harris polls worse than Biden by quite a bit.
A) I’m talking about who is next in line of succession, not the nomination. If Biden’s cabinet declares him unfit for office, Harris will become the President, but she doesn’t have to be the nominee. B) Actually, she doesn’t. Her approval is in a statistical tie with Biden’s, while her disapproval is much lower. I’m not saying she’s the best option (her numbers are about the same or worse than a lot of other potential candidates), but pretty much everyone’s polls are looking a little better than Biden’s now, and his are still going down.
Like the DNC saying it to anyone left of Reagan, Biden doesn’t want unity. He wants obedience.
I’d also like to add that no matter the person’s intent - power messes with people of all ages. There are so many people in government and the private sector that died in their appointed or elected seats.
Term limits are so very important to make our collective world better.
Agreed… But Biden hasn’t used up his limit… We also need cognitive testing or just plain old age limits
Yep yep the shit show we’re dealing with is the US is not just an executive branch government issue, even though it is the most pressing atm. It seems systemic throughout public and private sectors. We just can’t trust people to do the right thing without policy firmly in place on this issue.
For the avoidance of doubt for all reading this comment… I am voting blue no matter who.
Also, I think Biden might be doing a good job at “party unity” - in that, a lot of the party seems to be united in him not being the 2024 candidate.
Kind of a rock / hard place situation.
If they “force” him out without him dropping out, by faithless delegates or somesuch, it would reveal the entire process of selecting candidates is actually a meaningless farce (which everyone already kinda knew, but no one seems very interested in dispelling that myth just yet).
If he won’t consensually drop out within the next week I don’t see how they get rid of him without it being an even bigger clusterfuck.
It’s already a clusterfuck. The only question left being how long it’ll take to play out
What if the party unites to oust him?
They’d need to be in the same page for his replacement, or it’d be a shit show. A failed attempt would also look awful
My tinfoil hat conspiracy is that because Biden has shown a willingness to go after corporate interests, the money people want him gone. Hence the smear campaign.
Biden may be old, but he’s at least wise enough to surround himself with competent people. We can (and should) do better, but more turmoil and uncertainty is just going to drive us into the clutches of fascism.
Is it really fair to call it a smear campaign? It’s all out there in the open, we can ask pull up footage or transcripts any of his speeches. It’s not like we’re all just taking the media’s word for it on the man’s rapidly declining capacity to remain president.
It’s a smear campaign when compared to Trump’s behavior. On one hand, we have an old guy with a stutter who (at the very least) is still wise enough to surround himself with competent people. He may forget some things, but if you examine his record these past four years, he has wildly exceeded my very low expectations and demonstrated why he managed to make it to the Presidency.
On the other hand, you have another old guy who cannot open his mouth without telling bald-faced lies and whose mental state is rapidly deteriorating. Not to mention the crimes he’s committed. And yet, despite all this, the media is talking about how Biden is old and needs to drop out of the race, and not Trump.
Now, why do you think that is?
Well this post aged poorly
It sure did. And we usually have to wait a little longer before we get to say that, too.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
As more Democratic members of Congress urged him to drop out — bringing the total since his disastrous debate against Trump to nearly three dozen — Biden remained isolated at his beach house in Delaware after being diagnosed with COVID-19.
“By passing the torch, he would secure his legacy as one of our nation’s greatest leaders and allow us to unite behind a candidate who can best defeat Donald Trump and safeguard the future of our democracy,” said Heinrich, who’s up for reelection.
Separately, Rep. Sean Casten of Illinois wrote in an op-ed that with “a heavy heart and much personal reflection” he, too, was calling on Biden to “pass the torch to a new generation.”
Biden, 81, tested positive for COVID-19 while traveling in Las Vegas earlier this week and experienced “mild symptoms” including “general malaise” from the infection, the White House said.
But among Democrats nationwide, nearly two-thirds say Biden should step aside and let his party nominate a different candidate, according to an AP-NORC Center for Public Affairs Research poll.
Associated Press writers Joey Cappelletti in Lansing, Michigan, Ellen Knickmeyer in Aspen, Colorado, Steve Peoples in Milwaukee, and Josh Boak, Will Weissert, Mary Clare Jalonick, Seung Min Kim and Stephen Groves in Washington contributed to this report.
The original article contains 1,209 words, the summary contains 210 words. Saved 83%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
So… Now what…
