Like the baseline human aversion to harming others
Any evidence for that? In Islan we call that the fitra. The natural disposition that God placed in our souls. Every baby born, is born upon the fitra, the innate human nature . However this can be changed or corrupted due to people’s environments and people begin to accept immoral acts. Case in pont about homosexuality. It is goes against the fitra.
Your reasoning is circular. I can say anything and you’ll call it evidence for God. It’s absurd.
How is my reasoning circular? Can you explain how the universe/creation/existence started? There must be an initial force or power to place these things in motion. The universe wasn’t created in vacuum. If you think that, then I think the only one absurd is you because you are saying something can come from nothing.
The conscience is an evolutionary adaptation for the social species, giving the individual an aversion to harming others. No god needed.
What is the evidence for that? These are just theories you are posing but none of them can be proven scientifically. Like I said, you can’t measure the conscience under a microscope. You can’t even interact with it. Heck, scientists and philosophers can’t even agree on what the defintion is and what it entails.
Countless decades of research into human behaviour.
In Islan we call that the fitra
Yes, many religions claim to be able to explain these things.
The natural disposition that God placed in our souls.
Any evidence God placed it there?
However this can be changed or corrupted due to people’s environments and people begin to accept immoral acts. Case in pont about homosexuality. It is goes against the fitra.
How is it a corruption? Who is harmed?
How is my reasoning circular? Can you explain how the universe/creation/existence started?
What makes you think it “started”? It has always existed. You are only assuming it started, since you already believe your God created it, and therefore that must mean it started. And for anything you can no longer deny, then oh dear, must be evidence for god, like the conscience.
There must be an initial force or power to place these things in motion.
What makes you say that?
The universe wasn’t created in vacuum.
The vast majority of the universe is literally vacuum. And it wasn’t “created” - it has always existed.
If you think that, then I think the only one absurd is you because you are saying something can come from nothing.
It didn’t come from anywhere it all. Again, it has always been. Also, if you believe it was created, it is you who believes it came from nothing, and therefore you believing the absurd.
What is the evidence for that? These are just theories you are posing but none of them can be proven scientifically.
I’m assuming you haven’t even attempted to confirm your assumption that this hasn’t ever been studied.
you can’t measure the conscience under a microscope.
You can’t measure gravity under a microscope, either, or love. Yet we know these exist. I could turn this back on you - you can’t measure God under a microscope.
You can’t even interact with it.
Oh, you most certainly can. Suggest to a person that you’d like to go kill a puppy. You will find yourself face to face with the effects of their conscience.
Heck, scientists and philosophers can’t even agree on what the defintion is and what it entails.
The lack of a coherent definition does not entail its non-existence. I encourage you to attempt to define a chair, or a castle, in a satisfactory way that doesn’t exclude obvious chairs or castles, or include obvious non-chairs or castles. You’ll find this quite difficult, I assure you. And yet, this will not shake your belief in the existence of chairs or castles, will it?
I’m also left wondering where you’re going with this, since you leave no conclusion after suggesting that the conscience is a slippery concept. Are you, then, going to suggest that the conscience doesn’t exist, after earlier suggesting that the conscience is a gift from God himself? Why, it’s hard to even pin down what your argument is, since you change it moment to moment, based on what supports your continued simping for your Sky Fairy who hates gays.
The links you posted only contain the abstracts so I don’t have access to the full papers. Also all of them seem to base their research on the assumption of darwinian evolution which isn’t proven scientifically either. It’s a theory at the end of the day. Unlike Gravity which was promoted to a law because we can physically evaluate the effects of gravity. Evolution suggests humans evolved from apes just because we have similar properties but correlation does not equal causation.
What makes you think it “started”? It has always existed. You are only assuming it started, since you already believe your God created it, and therefore that must mean it started. And for anything you can no longer deny, then oh dear, must be evidence for god, like the conscience.
Countless research suggesting it has a beginning. Your basless claim that the universe always existed has no evidence. Whereas the conclusion that the universe has a beginning has much stronger evidence.
What makes you say that?
Because the universe has a beginning. The universe can’t create itself and it hasn’t always existed. You are left with only one option. The universe was created by an outside force. Something outside of the isolated system known as the universe.
It didn’t come from anywhere it all. Again, it has always been. Also, if you believe it was created, it is you who believes it came from nothing, and therefore you believing the absurd.
I’m not saying it came from nothing. I’m saying God created it. Which is not nothing. God is One and Self-Sufficient. Has no beginning nor end. And there is nothing comparable to Him. God creating the universe makes more sense than saying everything came from nothing. If you believe the universe always existed, that is a false assumption.
The vast majority of the universe is literally vacuum. And it wasn’t “created” - it has always existed.
That is complete nonsense. The fact you make this claim shows you never bothered to look into the origin of the universe. We have an estimated time when it started, 13.5 billion years ago. If the universe always existed, it would mean we have an infinite past and we would never exist in the first place. Also by you saying the universe always existed, are you implying that is your god? After all it led to your creation. Can something like the universe that has no will and no power bring about your conscience? Think about it. You are just ascribing God’s attributes to other entities.
Oh, you most certainly can. Suggest to a person that you’d like to go kill a puppy. You will find yourself face to face with the effects of their conscience.
I would get different reactions from different people. Some may enjoy the thought of that while most will despise that. Conscience cannot define morality and ethics.
You can’t measure gravity under a microscope, either, or love. Yet we know these exist. I could turn this back on you - you can’t measure God under a microscope.
Exactly why I’m saying that science can’t explain everything. There is more to life than the material world. This is precisely why you should look more into philosophy and religion. If you did your due diligence like I did, you would find Islam to be the truth.
I’m also left wondering where you’re going with this, since you leave no conclusion after suggesting that the conscience is a slippery concept. Are you, then, going to suggest that the conscience doesn’t exist, after earlier suggesting that the conscience is a gift from God himself? Why, it’s hard to even pin down what your argument is, since you change it moment to moment, based on what supports your continued simping for your Sky Fairy who hates gays.
All this questioning is to get you to think about your beliefs. I have my foundation based on sound evidence and rational inference via Islam. You have nothing. No foundation. All arbitrary. Putting science as your god isn’t helping you because it is constantly changing and at the end of the day, it is science that is research done by scientists that are human at the end of the day. Bound to make mistakes and constantly making contradictory conclusions. Would you rather follow man-made assumptions or God-given revelation?
Also have some decency. I never insulted you and if I did, I apologized for it. Your insults aren’t going to help me be more convinced by your arguments. Insulting only shows your you have no substance so you resort to adhominems. Unless you don’t care about that, in which case the only bigot here is you.
A theory never becomes a fact. It is just a best explanation with whatever evidence is in its favor but it is never proven. Here is an in-depth article explaining what theories actually are. Science is all about disproving, it can never prove anything.
“If someone tells you a scientific theory has been proven, you should ask what they mean by that. Normally, they mean “they’ve convinced themselves that this thing is true,” or they have overwhelming evidence that a specific idea is valid over a specific range. But nothing in science can ever truly be proven. It’s always subject to revision.”
You more or less made my point. It is our best and most reliable idea about the process, holding up to all our inquury so far. If there is a better idea, go ahead and present one.
Are you gonna go ahead and say it’s the creation myth? The hypothesis whose only backing is the book that came up with the idea?
No it did not prove your point because you said theories are proven which is not true. They are just a best guess. Like all of science at the end of the day.
There is no myth to creation. The universe had a beginning, the universe did not always exist, it did not create itself, then what else is left? You are left with only one option that an outside force/entity created the universe. You can label that force whatever you want but you’re just playing mental gymnastics which will inevitablty lead to the acceptance of a creator.
Any evidence for that? In Islan we call that the fitra. The natural disposition that God placed in our souls. Every baby born, is born upon the fitra, the innate human nature . However this can be changed or corrupted due to people’s environments and people begin to accept immoral acts. Case in pont about homosexuality. It is goes against the fitra.
How is my reasoning circular? Can you explain how the universe/creation/existence started? There must be an initial force or power to place these things in motion. The universe wasn’t created in vacuum. If you think that, then I think the only one absurd is you because you are saying something can come from nothing.
What is the evidence for that? These are just theories you are posing but none of them can be proven scientifically. Like I said, you can’t measure the conscience under a microscope. You can’t even interact with it. Heck, scientists and philosophers can’t even agree on what the defintion is and what it entails.
Countless decades of research into human behaviour.
Yes, many religions claim to be able to explain these things.
Any evidence God placed it there?
How is it a corruption? Who is harmed?
What makes you think it “started”? It has always existed. You are only assuming it started, since you already believe your God created it, and therefore that must mean it started. And for anything you can no longer deny, then oh dear, must be evidence for god, like the conscience.
What makes you say that?
The vast majority of the universe is literally vacuum. And it wasn’t “created” - it has always existed.
It didn’t come from anywhere it all. Again, it has always been. Also, if you believe it was created, it is you who believes it came from nothing, and therefore you believing the absurd.
https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1057/9781137391865_12
https://www.proquest.com/openview/947f27d2441b58d6/1?pq-origsite=gscholar&cbl=1017
http://www.czasopisma.uni.lodz.pl/ar/article/view/11208
https://books.google.co.uk/books?hl=en&lr=&id=lzsPBAAAQBAJ&oi=fnd&pg=PA27&dq=evolutionary+basis+for+conscience&ots=n2aHpix__E&sig=s-WfbYYj2D__-Da47xpxrenhL4s#v=onepage&q=evolutionary basis for conscience&f=false
I’m assuming you haven’t even attempted to confirm your assumption that this hasn’t ever been studied.
You can’t measure gravity under a microscope, either, or love. Yet we know these exist. I could turn this back on you - you can’t measure God under a microscope.
Oh, you most certainly can. Suggest to a person that you’d like to go kill a puppy. You will find yourself face to face with the effects of their conscience.
The lack of a coherent definition does not entail its non-existence. I encourage you to attempt to define a chair, or a castle, in a satisfactory way that doesn’t exclude obvious chairs or castles, or include obvious non-chairs or castles. You’ll find this quite difficult, I assure you. And yet, this will not shake your belief in the existence of chairs or castles, will it?
I’m also left wondering where you’re going with this, since you leave no conclusion after suggesting that the conscience is a slippery concept. Are you, then, going to suggest that the conscience doesn’t exist, after earlier suggesting that the conscience is a gift from God himself? Why, it’s hard to even pin down what your argument is, since you change it moment to moment, based on what supports your continued simping for your Sky Fairy who hates gays.
The links you posted only contain the abstracts so I don’t have access to the full papers. Also all of them seem to base their research on the assumption of darwinian evolution which isn’t proven scientifically either. It’s a theory at the end of the day. Unlike Gravity which was promoted to a law because we can physically evaluate the effects of gravity. Evolution suggests humans evolved from apes just because we have similar properties but correlation does not equal causation.
Countless research suggesting it has a beginning. Your basless claim that the universe always existed has no evidence. Whereas the conclusion that the universe has a beginning has much stronger evidence.
Because the universe has a beginning. The universe can’t create itself and it hasn’t always existed. You are left with only one option. The universe was created by an outside force. Something outside of the isolated system known as the universe.
I’m not saying it came from nothing. I’m saying God created it. Which is not nothing. God is One and Self-Sufficient. Has no beginning nor end. And there is nothing comparable to Him. God creating the universe makes more sense than saying everything came from nothing. If you believe the universe always existed, that is a false assumption.
That is complete nonsense. The fact you make this claim shows you never bothered to look into the origin of the universe. We have an estimated time when it started, 13.5 billion years ago. If the universe always existed, it would mean we have an infinite past and we would never exist in the first place. Also by you saying the universe always existed, are you implying that is your god? After all it led to your creation. Can something like the universe that has no will and no power bring about your conscience? Think about it. You are just ascribing God’s attributes to other entities.
I would get different reactions from different people. Some may enjoy the thought of that while most will despise that. Conscience cannot define morality and ethics.
Exactly why I’m saying that science can’t explain everything. There is more to life than the material world. This is precisely why you should look more into philosophy and religion. If you did your due diligence like I did, you would find Islam to be the truth.
All this questioning is to get you to think about your beliefs. I have my foundation based on sound evidence and rational inference via Islam. You have nothing. No foundation. All arbitrary. Putting science as your god isn’t helping you because it is constantly changing and at the end of the day, it is science that is research done by scientists that are human at the end of the day. Bound to make mistakes and constantly making contradictory conclusions. Would you rather follow man-made assumptions or God-given revelation?
Also have some decency. I never insulted you and if I did, I apologized for it. Your insults aren’t going to help me be more convinced by your arguments. Insulting only shows your you have no substance so you resort to adhominems. Unless you don’t care about that, in which case the only bigot here is you.
Evolution hasn’t been proven scientifically?
Yes it has not. It’s just a theory. There are a lot of scientific theories but that doesn’t mean they are proven. That’s why it’s a theory.
That’s a hypothesis. Theories are proven.
A theory never becomes a fact. It is just a best explanation with whatever evidence is in its favor but it is never proven. Here is an in-depth article explaining what theories actually are. Science is all about disproving, it can never prove anything.
“If someone tells you a scientific theory has been proven, you should ask what they mean by that. Normally, they mean “they’ve convinced themselves that this thing is true,” or they have overwhelming evidence that a specific idea is valid over a specific range. But nothing in science can ever truly be proven. It’s always subject to revision.”
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/11/22/scientific-proof-is-a-myth
You more or less made my point. It is our best and most reliable idea about the process, holding up to all our inquury so far. If there is a better idea, go ahead and present one.
Are you gonna go ahead and say it’s the creation myth? The hypothesis whose only backing is the book that came up with the idea?
No it did not prove your point because you said theories are proven which is not true. They are just a best guess. Like all of science at the end of the day.
There is no myth to creation. The universe had a beginning, the universe did not always exist, it did not create itself, then what else is left? You are left with only one option that an outside force/entity created the universe. You can label that force whatever you want but you’re just playing mental gymnastics which will inevitablty lead to the acceptance of a creator.