Word. ER has a ton of features to make the game easier for folks who want them. Hell, i’m one of those features, i’ve got my summon sign down to help with bosses all the time.
Being summoned to help strangers at the start of a dungeon I completed months ago and don’t remember my way to the boss through all its twists and turns… that’s a little less fun.
Please stop summoning me to the Subterranean Shunning Grounds I will only make you Even More Lost.
yeah but to actually use those features the game has to actually be playable by the person playing. if you physically can’t coordinate well enough to take advantage of absurd extra lightning damage, or even obtain things like that in the first place, than it doesn’t matter. people aren’t asking for difficulty options so they have access to even stronger stuff and easier gameplay from the perspective of a gamer that wants to develop skill and spend lots of time on it and has full ability to do so, they’re asking for easier gameplay from the perspective of someone who either can’t spend that much time (which is totally possible just by speeding up the progression loop a little, which despite many people’s complaints is comically easy, just make attacks easier to dodge and stuff so the skill curve is less steep), or someone who literally can’t use the control scheme well enough to play the game as intended (in which case the option to play a “sub-par”, “non-pure” version of the game is better than nothing so good by default)
“a game for everyone is a game for no one” is a dishonest statement in this scenario. The desire isn’t to make the game a game anyone would want to play, but to make it a game that people who DO want to play it CAN play.
I doubt it, the way any fromsoft game is made more or less prevents the addition of an easy mode because everything is carefully balanced and tuned around the current difficulty.
That’s just nonsense, though. Nothing about how the game is made prevents modifying the difficulty. There are mods that make the game easier, there’s nothing inherent to any fromsoft game that prevents the addition of an easy mode.
It doesn’t matter how it’s “balanced” because it’s a purely subjective thing, everyone has different abilities and the difficulty can never be perfectly tuned around each individual.
It would screw up a lot of gameplay and make it less rewarding. Take it from Myazaki: “Had we taken that approach, I don’t think the game would have done what it did, because the sense of achievement that players gain from overcoming these hurdles is such a fundamental part of the experience. Turning down difficulty would strip the game of that joy, which, in my eyes, would break the game itself.” Your right that it’s physically possible, but that defeats the point of the game.
It wouldn’t screw up the gameplay. It might make it less rewarding, but to who? The people who choose to play on an easier difficulty because of their abilities? Probably not.
If the point of a game is to be difficult and require the player to push outside of their comfort zone and outside of their abilities then what’s the point of making it easier. The nice part about not having a difficulty slider is that there’s no button to make a fight easier, you need to work to it. Difficulty settings are good for the majority of games, but most from games benefit off forcing you to suffer.
The way that this discussion always comes down to souls games, and they always get brought up in discussions about difficult and acessibility, highlights exactly what you’re talking about. You’re supposed to lose a whole lot of times before you win, and I think a lot of people who use souls games as an example of an “unfair” game either don’t understand that or refuse to understand that.
Plus, like. Summoning. You can summon two players to back you up. You might still die a lot, but if you’re able to use the game inputs, the controller, you can most likely beat the game with allies to help you out. I think a lot of folks think souls games are single player. Maybe because that’s how streamers play them? Idk.
Also, it’s never Sekiro that get’s brought up, with Sekiro having no Jolly Cooperation and likely being the most challenging of the Souls games.
Plus, like. Summoning. You can summon two players to back you up. You might still die a lot, but if you’re able to use the game inputs, the controller, you can most likely beat the game with allies to help you out.
This so much, plus I think a lot of people underestimate just how good getting summoned is
When playing as a summon in another player’s game you lose nothing when you die but you still get souls/runes from any enemies who die, that’s huge
You can just sit at the bonfire in your game where it’s safe and keep helping other players, getting more souls/runes with no risk of losing anything and maybe even learning the attack patterns of the enemies and the layout of the level along the way
I think a lot of folks think souls games are single player. Maybe because that’s how streamers play them? Idk.
Exactly and it’s a real waste because the co-op is one of the best parts of the game
I think a lot of streamers have bought into the hype that the games are all about difficulty and engaging in the co-op will lessen the experience when I find the opposite is true
The idea that co-op trivializes the game is pretty harmful to the community too, most of the actual tough bosses in the base game of Elden Ring are clearly designed with co-op in mind (Godfrey slamming the entire arena) and in some cases arguably get harder in co-op (Melania and the Fire Giant)
Also, it’s never Sekiro that get’s brought up, with Sekiro having no Jolly Cooperation and likely being the most challenging of the Souls games.
Yeah Armored Core too
I love Armored Core 6 but I only beat the real final boss due to pure dumb luck after like 50 tries and I don’t think I’ll ever beat it again, can’t even get an F or D ranking in the mission replay because I can’t beat it again
Also, it’s never Sekiro that get’s brought up, with Sekiro having no Jolly Cooperation and likely being the most challenging of the Souls games.
There’s a reason it’s the only Fromsoft soulslike I haven’t beat. I’ve been stuck on one of the fights with the main antagonist with the lightning sword for months. And Sekiro doesn’t have a normal leveling system, so you can’t just grind and over level to get past.
The problem with this idea is that it assumes everyone has the exact same capabilities. The game might be completely off the table for some players and I think that would be a real shame because it’s an excellent game.
It doesn’t assume everyone has the same capabilities. If you aren’t capable of beating a boss in er, you find more areas to explore, more sidequests to do and over level yourself and your weapons. It’s going to be harder, albeit more rewarding. Other fs games are different and don’t have the same fail to progress model and with those it becomes a lot harder if you don’t have the capabilities.
There are people that wouldn’t be able to beat it even if they took advantage of all those things. It also means you get two different experiences depending on your abilities. One of them can be a well paced challenging game and the other is a grindy slog that always feels unfair.
Our goal involves creating a compelling progression path for all of our players. There’s a lot of content at launch with even more coming via live service, and we’ll continuously adjust our progression mechanics to give players a sense of accomplishment as they explore all of Battlefront 2
Our goal involves creating a compelling progression path for all of our players. There’s a lot of content at launch with even more coming via live service, and we’ll continuously adjust our progression mechanics to give players a sense of accomplishment as they explore all of Battlefront 2
There already is an easy mode, it’s called leveling up, summoning co-op, and getting better gear.
You’re not just asking to make the game easier, you’re saying you don’t want to spend any time or effort to make that happen. The game is based around spending time and effort to overcome challenges. You do not want to engage with the games core mechanics and that’s fine, but don’t blame the game. I say this without judgment, just watch a playthrough and then explore the world with cheat engine.
It’s the nature of the game. Elden ring has fail-forward levelling. Eith you beat the boss, or you accumulate xp beating your head against the boss until you win. And a lot of it is about building knowledge - learning enemy attack patterns, figuring out which weapons and spells work against which enemies
What i get from most complaints about Souls games is people don’t actually want to play souls games. Maybe they think they do, but there seems to e a misunderstanding of what the core gameplay of souls games is and how they work. Like people look at them and think that if it weren’t for the inaccessible combat then souls games could be played like Skyrim or Mass Effect. And that’s not the case. There are very very few, very austere quests. There’s almost no dialogue. Character development, such as there is, is mostly implied.
Combat is pretty much the whole game. If you weren’t being seriously challeneged by the enemies you could beat the game in, idk, two hours maybe if you knew where to go? You need to beat two bosses, then one boss, then one boss, then the game is over.
well, replace “boss” with “enemies that i haven’t killed easily for the hundreth time so i can level up” and “learn move patterns” with “become skilled at a game that i might not even be able to play at baseline because it’s designed around the skill cap of a fully abled player” and “explore” with “fully map out spaces designed for someone with the spatial navigation of a fully abled player”
No one says that. I played through Elden Ring, I died a lot, I loved it. I thought it was generally fair and rewarding. I still think it should have a difficulty option because that’s not going to be everybody’s experience and it wouldn’t affect mine or yours if it did have it as an option.
uggggh nobody should have to spend fucking time and effort to be able to play it with a disability ffs, they should just be able to have the exact progression you’re talking about in the way any abled person would from the beginning of the game and that plus a way to make that loop shorter for those with less time’s all anyone’s asking for
I really love that balance in fromsoft games. I love the level of tuning they do to make it feel like a fair challenge versus frustrating and cheap. I also feel that that balance is what gives the games its atmosphere and moment to moment appeal, because it forces you to consider your next step, to consider the risk/reward of going a little further vs turning back etc.
I could see how difficulty modes could cause problems or at least tons of work if they were trying to tune that balance for each difficulty. But, I’m all for accessbility options and modes. If there’s an easy or accessibility option thats allows more people to play and enjoy souls without detracting from the standard experience that i enjoy then that sounds good to me.
I wonder if the guy behind dark souls feels some regret spawning an entire generation of G*mers insufferable about difficulty in their games.
“I want to preface this by saying I absolutely suck at video games, so my approach or play style was to use everything I have at my disposal, all the assistance, every scrap of aid that the game offers, and also all the knowledge that I have as the architect of the game … the freedom and open-world nature of Elden Ring perhaps lowered the barrier to entry, and I might be the one who’s benefiting the most from that, as a player, more than anyone else.”-Miyazaki
"Oh yeah Saint Miyazaki? Git gud :smuglord: "
Word. ER has a ton of features to make the game easier for folks who want them. Hell, i’m one of those features, i’ve got my summon sign down to help with bosses all the time.
Being summoned to help strangers with bosses is my favorite part of souls games
Being summoned to help strangers at the start of a dungeon I completed months ago and don’t remember my way to the boss through all its twists and turns… that’s a little less fun.
Please stop summoning me to the Subterranean Shunning Grounds I will only make you Even More Lost.
yeah but to actually use those features the game has to actually be playable by the person playing. if you physically can’t coordinate well enough to take advantage of absurd extra lightning damage, or even obtain things like that in the first place, than it doesn’t matter. people aren’t asking for difficulty options so they have access to even stronger stuff and easier gameplay from the perspective of a gamer that wants to develop skill and spend lots of time on it and has full ability to do so, they’re asking for easier gameplay from the perspective of someone who either can’t spend that much time (which is totally possible just by speeding up the progression loop a little, which despite many people’s complaints is comically easy, just make attacks easier to dodge and stuff so the skill curve is less steep), or someone who literally can’t use the control scheme well enough to play the game as intended (in which case the option to play a “sub-par”, “non-pure” version of the game is better than nothing so good by default)
“a game for everyone is a game for no one” is a dishonest statement in this scenario. The desire isn’t to make the game a game anyone would want to play, but to make it a game that people who DO want to play it CAN play.
I doubt it, the way any fromsoft game is made more or less prevents the addition of an easy mode because everything is carefully balanced and tuned around the current difficulty.
That’s just nonsense, though. Nothing about how the game is made prevents modifying the difficulty. There are mods that make the game easier, there’s nothing inherent to any fromsoft game that prevents the addition of an easy mode.
It doesn’t matter how it’s “balanced” because it’s a purely subjective thing, everyone has different abilities and the difficulty can never be perfectly tuned around each individual.
It would screw up a lot of gameplay and make it less rewarding. Take it from Myazaki: “Had we taken that approach, I don’t think the game would have done what it did, because the sense of achievement that players gain from overcoming these hurdles is such a fundamental part of the experience. Turning down difficulty would strip the game of that joy, which, in my eyes, would break the game itself.” Your right that it’s physically possible, but that defeats the point of the game.
It wouldn’t screw up the gameplay. It might make it less rewarding, but to who? The people who choose to play on an easier difficulty because of their abilities? Probably not.
If the point of a game is to be difficult and require the player to push outside of their comfort zone and outside of their abilities then what’s the point of making it easier. The nice part about not having a difficulty slider is that there’s no button to make a fight easier, you need to work to it. Difficulty settings are good for the majority of games, but most from games benefit off forcing you to suffer.
The way that this discussion always comes down to souls games, and they always get brought up in discussions about difficult and acessibility, highlights exactly what you’re talking about. You’re supposed to lose a whole lot of times before you win, and I think a lot of people who use souls games as an example of an “unfair” game either don’t understand that or refuse to understand that.
Plus, like. Summoning. You can summon two players to back you up. You might still die a lot, but if you’re able to use the game inputs, the controller, you can most likely beat the game with allies to help you out. I think a lot of folks think souls games are single player. Maybe because that’s how streamers play them? Idk.
Also, it’s never Sekiro that get’s brought up, with Sekiro having no Jolly Cooperation and likely being the most challenging of the Souls games.
This so much, plus I think a lot of people underestimate just how good getting summoned is
When playing as a summon in another player’s game you lose nothing when you die but you still get souls/runes from any enemies who die, that’s huge
You can just sit at the bonfire in your game where it’s safe and keep helping other players, getting more souls/runes with no risk of losing anything and maybe even learning the attack patterns of the enemies and the layout of the level along the way
Exactly and it’s a real waste because the co-op is one of the best parts of the game
I think a lot of streamers have bought into the hype that the games are all about difficulty and engaging in the co-op will lessen the experience when I find the opposite is true
The idea that co-op trivializes the game is pretty harmful to the community too, most of the actual tough bosses in the base game of Elden Ring are clearly designed with co-op in mind (Godfrey slamming the entire arena) and in some cases arguably get harder in co-op (Melania and the Fire Giant)
Yeah Armored Core too
I love Armored Core 6 but I only beat the real final boss due to pure dumb luck after like 50 tries and I don’t think I’ll ever beat it again, can’t even get an F or D ranking in the mission replay because I can’t beat it again
God AC6 is so fucking hard. I straight up game up and went back to Elden Ring.
There’s a reason it’s the only Fromsoft soulslike I haven’t beat. I’ve been stuck on one of the fights with the main antagonist with the lightning sword for months. And Sekiro doesn’t have a normal leveling system, so you can’t just grind and over level to get past.
The problem with this idea is that it assumes everyone has the exact same capabilities. The game might be completely off the table for some players and I think that would be a real shame because it’s an excellent game.
It doesn’t assume everyone has the same capabilities. If you aren’t capable of beating a boss in er, you find more areas to explore, more sidequests to do and over level yourself and your weapons. It’s going to be harder, albeit more rewarding. Other fs games are different and don’t have the same fail to progress model and with those it becomes a lot harder if you don’t have the capabilities.
There are people that wouldn’t be able to beat it even if they took advantage of all those things. It also means you get two different experiences depending on your abilities. One of them can be a well paced challenging game and the other is a grindy slog that always feels unfair.
Our goal involves creating a compelling progression path for all of our players. There’s a lot of content at launch with even more coming via live service, and we’ll continuously adjust our progression mechanics to give players a sense of accomplishment as they explore all of Battlefront 2
What?
Our goal involves creating a compelling progression path for all of our players. There’s a lot of content at launch with even more coming via live service, and we’ll continuously adjust our progression mechanics to give players a sense of accomplishment as they explore all of Battlefront 2
That was about paid dlcs.
Yes, because not including difficulty settings is the exact same as extorting money out of consumers.
if you can’t play a game you brought than it is, yeah!
There already is an easy mode, it’s called leveling up, summoning co-op, and getting better gear.
You’re not just asking to make the game easier, you’re saying you don’t want to spend any time or effort to make that happen. The game is based around spending time and effort to overcome challenges. You do not want to engage with the games core mechanics and that’s fine, but don’t blame the game. I say this without judgment, just watch a playthrough and then explore the world with cheat engine.
Imagine being unironically pro-grinding.
It’s the nature of the game. Elden ring has fail-forward levelling. Eith you beat the boss, or you accumulate xp beating your head against the boss until you win. And a lot of it is about building knowledge - learning enemy attack patterns, figuring out which weapons and spells work against which enemies
What i get from most complaints about Souls games is people don’t actually want to play souls games. Maybe they think they do, but there seems to e a misunderstanding of what the core gameplay of souls games is and how they work. Like people look at them and think that if it weren’t for the inaccessible combat then souls games could be played like Skyrim or Mass Effect. And that’s not the case. There are very very few, very austere quests. There’s almost no dialogue. Character development, such as there is, is mostly implied.
Combat is pretty much the whole game. If you weren’t being seriously challeneged by the enemies you could beat the game in, idk, two hours maybe if you knew where to go? You need to beat two bosses, then one boss, then one boss, then the game is over.
Grinding is when I don’t jump from boss to boss, one shotting all of them. The more you force me to explore or learn move patterns, the grinder it is.
yes
well, replace “boss” with “enemies that i haven’t killed easily for the hundreth time so i can level up” and “learn move patterns” with “become skilled at a game that i might not even be able to play at baseline because it’s designed around the skill cap of a fully abled player” and “explore” with “fully map out spaces designed for someone with the spatial navigation of a fully abled player”
Removed by mod
Removed by mod
No one says that. I played through Elden Ring, I died a lot, I loved it. I thought it was generally fair and rewarding. I still think it should have a difficulty option because that’s not going to be everybody’s experience and it wouldn’t affect mine or yours if it did have it as an option.
uggggh nobody should have to spend fucking time and effort to be able to play it with a disability ffs, they should just be able to have the exact progression you’re talking about in the way any abled person would from the beginning of the game and that plus a way to make that loop shorter for those with less time’s all anyone’s asking for
Cheat engine to the rescue!
Removed by mod
Balance exists as a dynamic relation between the game and the player, it’s not a static, immutable quality incased within the game.
Homie I just want to explore the world and take in the scenery
Just playing for exploration. Pesky pests are in my way. Get out!
I really love that balance in fromsoft games. I love the level of tuning they do to make it feel like a fair challenge versus frustrating and cheap. I also feel that that balance is what gives the games its atmosphere and moment to moment appeal, because it forces you to consider your next step, to consider the risk/reward of going a little further vs turning back etc.
I could see how difficulty modes could cause problems or at least tons of work if they were trying to tune that balance for each difficulty. But, I’m all for accessbility options and modes. If there’s an easy or accessibility option thats allows more people to play and enjoy souls without detracting from the standard experience that i enjoy then that sounds good to me.