As a mental health counselor, I’m very familiar with the wealth of psychological literature that documents how suicide attempts are overwhelmingly the product of impulses that occur in very short-lived moments of utter despair, and that most survivors of SAs regret making them.
However, I am also intimately familiar with how horrendously torturous life can be, even when one’s external circumstances aren’t that bad, and it is my firm belief that it should be an inalienable human right to “get off the ride” so to speak. To that end, I’m for governments providing suicide assistance to people who demonstrate a prolonged desire to end their own lives that cannot be reasonably argued to be an impulse due to temporarily depressed mood. There do need to be limitations to protect people from acting rashly or on deluded beliefs that stem from psychosis or mania (e.g. a schizophrenic person wanting to kill themselves because they believe they’re a host for the Devil as opposed to the much more rational reason of simply being sick of dealing with the illness itself), but overall I’m against requiring people to have a terminal illness or even just requiring them to get treatment for their depression. IMO, right to die should be universal, and restrictions on it should require strong arguments and support. You want to die because your weird religious beliefs deem it a sin to live past 30? Well…not my cup’o’tea, but that’s your right.
I also just kind of think making suicide illegal is stupid. Seriously suicidal people are going to kill themselves regardless of the law; all making it illegal does is force these folks to go about it via means that may be either ineffectual and self-harming and/or risk harming others.
If the government isn’t going to bother to help these people why force them to stay alive if they have really thought about it and would rather be dead? People kill themselves for a variety of reasons, at least in this case they tried to get help and can die peacefully instead of some of the other horrific methods desperate people end up using.
We should be expanding access to mental health treatment, fixing income inequality, stop fucking over disabled people, etc. But that’s obviously the opposite of what has been happening, and I agree with you… People should have the right to die if that’s what they really want given the situation they are in. And if that is genocide, that genocide has already been happening just in a much more brutal way. It’s not like someone who bothers to go through this process who gets rejected is just going to be like “oh well, the government said I can’t end my life guess I need to listen”
I suppose you’re probably the best person to ask about this. Do you have a grasp on how much of the “people regret their failed SAs” phenomenon is due to the classic “I realized in that moment that life was worth living and I made a terrible decision” thought, versus things like being hospitalized (most likely including time in the psych ward) after the fact, long term consequences (which may include injuries, disfigurement, long term physical/cognitive/other problems, six figure hospital bills in the US, etc), shame about the whole matter which may include shame that “they couldn’t even do that right”, etc…?
My understanding is that it’s mostly a mix of in-the-moment and shortly-afterwards responses that range from instant regret to frustration to relief to hope, etc. Then there are those who fall back easily into despair, but they’re in the minority and there are usually very clear reasons they have a harder time recovering. I can tell you anecdotally from my own practice that while my patients have certainly minded the inconvenience and degradation of being hospitalized against their wills, of those who have been hospitalized over an actual suicide attempt (i.e. not merely the potential for one seen in intense suicidal ideation), none have complained about the care they received in the wake of said attempt. They know—in that instance—it’s appropriate.
I don’t have the access to professional papers that I used to, but this page from the Harvard School of Public Health should tell you something about what the literature says regarding suicide attempts and their likelihood of recurring.
I know this is anecdotal, but I’ve had a failed suicide attempt which I only survived with medical intervention and pretty much everything u/asparagus said above was spot on. I never had any regret from deciding after-the-fact that I wanted to live, it just never happened for me. The only regret I have is that it wasn’t able to work - because all of the fallout that came from it has been worse than what led me to that decision in the first place.
the attempt itself was something I had been thinking about for a while and prepared the items to do it with quite a bit before that day. but on the day it happened something had just boiled over, can’t even remember what it was for the life of me. so there’s an element of impulsiveness there, but all that did was set the date so to speak. it’s been around 3ish years since then and it’s kind of surprising how much of my time is spent thinking about it all still. from the moment I woke up in the ER to now there’s just this dread that is always present. any time I have difficulty with really anything now, I’m always just thinking about how I made the decision to not participate in any of this and I shouldn’t have to deal with it at all - and that itself makes me really bitter/jaded I think.
anyways just wanted to share because the person before you hit the nail on the head for what my experience with it all has been
That sounds like a lot to deal with. I would hope you’re getting some professional help. If not, you can always either call your insurance company for referrals to MH services or just dial 988 for government referrals. And if you don’t have much contact with friends or family or some other support group, please contact NAMI.
thanks, I have a pretty good support network to help deal with things. also have a therapist and psychiatrist that I see regularly
Canadians: “We need more and better funding for healthcare, especially mental healthcare.”
Canadian gov’t: “Sure would be cheaper for us if you just fucking died.”
Like, I am in no way against MAID, but the expansion as to what qualifies for it is starting to scare me. We already have a case of a woman seeking MAID because it was easier than finding affordable housing that accomodates her disabilities.
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Absolutely. It’s becoming the replacement for actual care and support, legalized, a coerced, slow-moving genocide of the mentally ill and disabled because not even “socialist healthcare canada” (as idiot Americans call it) wants to support people who can’t churn the cogs of capital.
What is funny about the US is that if you can’t turn the cog of capitalism, healthcare is free. Being very poor is really baller for treating your horrific medical conditions. So is being old.
I’m an able bodied worker who has to worry about medication to keep at bay my murderous condition only because I can work. If I just quit my job and was willing to live in public housing and all my bullshit, all the stress of treatment would actually go away.
I have no idea why Americans are against expanding Medicare when poor people already get it. Why would they want to deny themselves what they’re paying for anyway by virtue of not being able to have it.
If anyone should be allowed to experiment with mushrooms and cannabis it should be her.
Cannabis is legal in Canada.
I never understood why is assisted suicide illegal.
I understand that there are dangers of misuse, but some cases are obvious.
While I have found help and I am living good life now, I was in the problem for 15 years and even thou I am happy now - I still think it was not worth it.
If I knew how bad my next 15 years would be, I would like to finish it long time ago.
That’s main reason I like Klingons so much.
100%
i did not consent to this. i withdraw my consent.
the end.
Because companies make money off it, which means they have incentives to push people into suicide instead of looking for ways to make their lives better
And honestly this would be the main reason to be against it. All avenues need to be exhausted before as is used, in my opinion.
I think because of very valid fears about it being a cover for genocide. In the US we have very much done genocide like things like systematically taking women’s reproductive organs. That one wasn’t even that long ago when that one happened.
Looking at Canada, I’m not sure that assisted suicide won’t always be used for genocide. You already have stories of people seeking it for no other reason than being disabled and poor in Canada is so hard they don’t want to try anymore.
I dont think that the slow miserable death that is how dying is nowadays is great, but I do think that there’s a valid reason people don’t like the idea of the government sanctioning suicide when the government is perfectly capable of driving people to it. You make suicide boring and a lot of atrocities will be overlooked. Something being legal and on the surface perfectly okay can allow a bunch of terrible things to happen.
As a severely mentally ill disabled person I don’t think suicide should be the solution to a neoliberal society that refuses to adequately support the vulnerable. But honestly my support needs are not met and I’m so exhausted from trying to fight for them that I wish this was an option in my country. Support our needs or let us have the dignity to leave a world that doesn’t want us.
doesnt she just need to stop eating entirely? sounds like she’s almost there
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