The only thing i want is DIY paper printer with open source driver + DIY ink cartridges.
It’s kinda weird to me because i can find DIY 3d printer + it’s driver (open source) online, but no company made DIY paper printer with DIY cartridges until now
Fuck HP, Epson, Canon, or whatever big company printers out there
Well we don’t know if no one start to made it it
I think it’s good if someone out there trying to make open source driver, imagine if we can add more features to our printers (like duplex A5 printing for your case) & especially if you can bypass HP printers that can broken printer if you used aftermarket ink
If such a thing exists (DIY paper printers), I would like to know more, because the level of frustration I have with all the major printer mfrs I’ve used, is too damn high.
Bonus points if it’s a laser printer, extra bonus points if the components for the printer can be 3D printed (with obvious exceptions).
I just want a good, wired, network printer for everyday crap that I can use once in a blue moon for stupid documents that someone wants me to print, sign, scan and send back to them because they haven’t figured out how to do e-signatures yet… And the odd extra thing I need to print. Every time I print it seems like I need to reinstall the printer or update something to make it work. I buy laser printers so the ink doesn’t dry out before I can use it. The whole thing is so damned frustrating. Also, bluntly, unless you’re doing photo work, never buy an inkjet. They’re cheap, and there’s a reason they’re cheap. Inkjet has better color representation, so photo printers should probably be inkjet, for everything else, do yourself a favor and buy a laser printer. Toner lasts much, much, longer.
Well what’s different with 3d printer ?
I think 3d printer it’s very complicated compared to paper printer because 3d printer can print objects in 3d (need to calibrated in x,y,z position just to make it right) but paper printer just 2d
I think the right answer because no one want to make it because the business model of selling paper printer itself already at profit loss, printer company made profits from selling ink cartridges not from selling the printer itself
The pulses of the laser and the pitch of those LEDs is generally way finer than what your run of the mill 3D printer is able to achieve reliably. And definitely finer than any nozzle you could put onto a 3D printer.
Theoretically you could DIY the spinning mirror approach, but it would be difficult to source the optical parts, and calibrating it would be a gigantic pain in the ass. Not to mention that it would likely be significantly more expensive than an off-the-shelf laser printer.
Also, guess what happens if you don’t have toner cartridge and print drum as one sealed unit. The printing medium is so fine it gets everywhere, ask anyone who ever tried reloading one of those cartridges.
Square Singer explained the difference with InkJet above.
Modern paper printers are deceptively advanced machines. They’d be pretty impressive if not for the greed of the manufacturers. High-precision parts made just right so that you could print out whatever annoying document your employer wants you to actually sign and bring in physically.
A 3D printer is comparatively slow and generally prints in one colour. As I said, you can make a plotter easily by swapping out the print head for a pen, but then you have a single-colour printer that’s significantly slower than modern laser printers, that can be upgraded to have multiple colours with a toolchanger but won’t produce anything near the resolution of an inkjet (or even a laser printer, tbh).
I feel like theoretically it maybe could be possible to turn an SLA printer into a paper printer, with resin solidifying on a page? But then how would you keep the rest of the page from being smudged?
A 3D printer (talking here about FDM because SLA really shares nothing at all with a 2D printer) is basically a tiny hot glue gun being moved on three axies by stepper motors. Of course, the temperature and extrusion controls are much more accurate than a hot glue gun, but that’s the basic principle. You got a single “printing point” that gets moved around and it only extrudes filament from that single point.
An inkjet printer has one stepper motor that moves the paper and another that moves the print head from left to right. So there too are axies moved on stepper motors. A very simple trait also shared by e.g. CD and disk drives, slot machines, camera lenses and many other things. All these things are as close to a 2D printer as a 3D printer.
The real magic of an inkjet printer is the print head. A print head doesn’t have a single nozzle but an array of many nozzles. This way, a printer cannot only print one dot at a time, but instead a few lines at a time. These nozzles are much tinier that the nozzles on a 3D printer, and they also are much more complicated to operate.
A 3D printer just uses a stepper motor to push filament into the printhead, where it melts and is then pushed out of a hole.
On an inkjet printer, you need to either rapidly boil the ink, so that a single vapor bubble appears that pushes just a tiny drop of ink on the paper, or you have a tiny piezoelectric transducer that creats a vibration that then pushes out ink.
This is orders of magnitude more difficult than a 3D printer, and much tinier. You won’t be DIYing a working 2D printer from scratch, while that isn’t all that hard for a 3D printer. With access to a decent toolshop, you can make all relevant parts of a 3D printer. The same is not true for 2D printers.
To rephrase your question: Why is it that so many people build DIY desktop PCs, but nobody is making a DIY flagship smartphone? What’s the difference?
TIL inkjet printer is very complicated compared to 3d printer
I always think paper printer is very easy to make (well since so many paper printers out there compared to 3d printers)
Yeah, that’s more due to need than due to technical difficulty.
Even in 2024 it’s still common that you have to print out documents to sign them or tickets for some event or something like that. All these (quite relevant) use cases just don’t work if you don’t have a 2D printer.
As much as I like my 3D printer, and as much as I recommend everyone to have one, is not nearly as necessary.
In regards to how difficult they are to make, consider the price.
2D printers have an advantage due to their much higher sales numbers (economy of scale) and they are subsidized by the manufacturer selling expensive ink. And still, a half-decent inkjet costs €100 or more, and a color laser easily costs €300 or more.
3D printers usually have much lower sales numbers and people usually buy 3rd party filament, so the printer needs to be expensive enough to generate money for the manufacturer. And still you can get a decent Ender 3 for as low as €150.
Pen plotters are also much slower than inkjet printers, can’t effectively mix inks for composite colors, and are significantly lower resolution than any other 2D print technology. Pen plotters existed before ink or laser jet, they lost their market share for good reasons.
You can buy a DIY opensource 3D printer that can print on paper by putting a pen where the extruder is and use some open source software to convert text in GCODE.
The only thing i want is DIY paper printer with open source driver + DIY ink cartridges.
It’s kinda weird to me because i can find DIY 3d printer + it’s driver (open source) online, but no company made DIY paper printer with DIY cartridges until now
Fuck HP, Epson, Canon, or whatever big company printers out there
I have a Brother laser printer. (I love it, but that’s not important here.)
The firmware doesn’t support duplexing A5 paper. I’m wondering if this is a good place to dip my toe into the world of open source driver development.
Well we don’t know if no one start to made it it
I think it’s good if someone out there trying to make open source driver, imagine if we can add more features to our printers (like duplex A5 printing for your case) & especially if you can bypass HP printers that can broken printer if you used aftermarket ink
If such a thing exists (DIY paper printers), I would like to know more, because the level of frustration I have with all the major printer mfrs I’ve used, is too damn high.
Bonus points if it’s a laser printer, extra bonus points if the components for the printer can be 3D printed (with obvious exceptions).
I just want a good, wired, network printer for everyday crap that I can use once in a blue moon for stupid documents that someone wants me to print, sign, scan and send back to them because they haven’t figured out how to do e-signatures yet… And the odd extra thing I need to print. Every time I print it seems like I need to reinstall the printer or update something to make it work. I buy laser printers so the ink doesn’t dry out before I can use it. The whole thing is so damned frustrating. Also, bluntly, unless you’re doing photo work, never buy an inkjet. They’re cheap, and there’s a reason they’re cheap. Inkjet has better color representation, so photo printers should probably be inkjet, for everything else, do yourself a favor and buy a laser printer. Toner lasts much, much, longer.
The problem is the most important parts of inkjet/laser printers are pretty difficult to make by hand.
You can DIY a plotter though. Probably could figure out a continuous supply of ink to the pen too?
Well what’s different with 3d printer ?
I think 3d printer it’s very complicated compared to paper printer because 3d printer can print objects in 3d (need to calibrated in x,y,z position just to make it right) but paper printer just 2d
I think the right answer because no one want to make it because the business model of selling paper printer itself already at profit loss, printer company made profits from selling ink cartridges not from selling the printer itself
Resolution, generally.
A laser printer operates by using UV light to make fine pigment powder stick to a drum by static electricity. True to it’s name, it used to be done via a laser that scanned the drum by reflecting off a rotating mirror - but nowadays it’s just as often a line of tiny UV LEDs. The pigment is than baked onto the paper by a small electric oven.
The pulses of the laser and the pitch of those LEDs is generally way finer than what your run of the mill 3D printer is able to achieve reliably. And definitely finer than any nozzle you could put onto a 3D printer.
Theoretically you could DIY the spinning mirror approach, but it would be difficult to source the optical parts, and calibrating it would be a gigantic pain in the ass. Not to mention that it would likely be significantly more expensive than an off-the-shelf laser printer.
Also, guess what happens if you don’t have toner cartridge and print drum as one sealed unit. The printing medium is so fine it gets everywhere, ask anyone who ever tried reloading one of those cartridges.
Square Singer explained the difference with InkJet above.
Modern paper printers are deceptively advanced machines. They’d be pretty impressive if not for the greed of the manufacturers. High-precision parts made just right so that you could print out whatever annoying document your employer wants you to actually sign and bring in physically.
A 3D printer is comparatively slow and generally prints in one colour. As I said, you can make a plotter easily by swapping out the print head for a pen, but then you have a single-colour printer that’s significantly slower than modern laser printers, that can be upgraded to have multiple colours with a toolchanger but won’t produce anything near the resolution of an inkjet (or even a laser printer, tbh).
For reference, this is how a plotter at work looks like. Similar to bed slingers, ain’t it.
I feel like theoretically it maybe could be possible to turn an SLA printer into a paper printer, with resin solidifying on a page? But then how would you keep the rest of the page from being smudged?
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
this is how a plotter at work looks like
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
What’s different? Basically the whole thing.
A 3D printer (talking here about FDM because SLA really shares nothing at all with a 2D printer) is basically a tiny hot glue gun being moved on three axies by stepper motors. Of course, the temperature and extrusion controls are much more accurate than a hot glue gun, but that’s the basic principle. You got a single “printing point” that gets moved around and it only extrudes filament from that single point.
An inkjet printer has one stepper motor that moves the paper and another that moves the print head from left to right. So there too are axies moved on stepper motors. A very simple trait also shared by e.g. CD and disk drives, slot machines, camera lenses and many other things. All these things are as close to a 2D printer as a 3D printer.
The real magic of an inkjet printer is the print head. A print head doesn’t have a single nozzle but an array of many nozzles. This way, a printer cannot only print one dot at a time, but instead a few lines at a time. These nozzles are much tinier that the nozzles on a 3D printer, and they also are much more complicated to operate.
A 3D printer just uses a stepper motor to push filament into the printhead, where it melts and is then pushed out of a hole.
On an inkjet printer, you need to either rapidly boil the ink, so that a single vapor bubble appears that pushes just a tiny drop of ink on the paper, or you have a tiny piezoelectric transducer that creats a vibration that then pushes out ink.
This is orders of magnitude more difficult than a 3D printer, and much tinier. You won’t be DIYing a working 2D printer from scratch, while that isn’t all that hard for a 3D printer. With access to a decent toolshop, you can make all relevant parts of a 3D printer. The same is not true for 2D printers.
To rephrase your question: Why is it that so many people build DIY desktop PCs, but nobody is making a DIY flagship smartphone? What’s the difference?
Basically everything.
Man, your explanation is way better than mine, kudos! :D
TIL inkjet printer is very complicated compared to 3d printer
I always think paper printer is very easy to make (well since so many paper printers out there compared to 3d printers)
Yeah, that’s more due to need than due to technical difficulty.
Even in 2024 it’s still common that you have to print out documents to sign them or tickets for some event or something like that. All these (quite relevant) use cases just don’t work if you don’t have a 2D printer.
As much as I like my 3D printer, and as much as I recommend everyone to have one, is not nearly as necessary.
In regards to how difficult they are to make, consider the price.
2D printers have an advantage due to their much higher sales numbers (economy of scale) and they are subsidized by the manufacturer selling expensive ink. And still, a half-decent inkjet costs €100 or more, and a color laser easily costs €300 or more.
3D printers usually have much lower sales numbers and people usually buy 3rd party filament, so the printer needs to be expensive enough to generate money for the manufacturer. And still you can get a decent Ender 3 for as low as €150.
Pen plotters are also much slower than inkjet printers, can’t effectively mix inks for composite colors, and are significantly lower resolution than any other 2D print technology. Pen plotters existed before ink or laser jet, they lost their market share for good reasons.
An open source printer, you say? Interesting idea
Well, you can buy rubber stamps?
Super agree, paper printers are a scam imo
You can buy a DIY opensource 3D printer that can print on paper by putting a pen where the extruder is and use some open source software to convert text in GCODE.
https://github.com/boy1dr/3DWriter https://indestructables.private.coffee/Turn-Your-3D-Printer-Into-a-Plotter/